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hsimpsonjr
Joined: 16 Dec 2006
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#1 · Posted: 18 Oct 2007 10:24
Yesterday there was a big post on the WAHM forum but now it is gone. Coastal was on the list they published that were affected by their new decision but I don't know why since we aren't a travel agency. Why would they put us on this list?
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asskusabouttrav
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#2 · Posted: 18 Oct 2007 11:48
Hi Harold
From what I understand they(Royal Car.) is severing all ties with the so called "card mill" type agencies.
To my knowledge this will include Joystar, YTB, Inteletravel and similiar agencies that offer the IATA credentials at only a cost. Some of these groups are not educating their individual members.
I for one am a member of inteletravel and have seen some fantastic beneifits of being a member and signing other people up.
Recently though, I have discovered that I too am in need of a true education if I am to become an independant travel agent.
I will therefor be transferring my existing IATA number(inteletravel) over to a new group. I will emerse myself in the education provided and will in due time have an IATA number that is mine and mine alone.
These credentials will come to me through sales volume and courses offered through this new program.
Now again Harold, This is what I read into the press releases. Although Inteletravel wasnt named in that list I had the feeling that it will soon be.
Those of you who are with one of these groups. I dont want to scare any of you. But I do urge you to research where you are and who you are affiliated with.
I would love to hear other peoples thoughts on this as well. There are probably many out there with far more experience in this matter than I. But as it sits, I have decided to transfer my existing credentials to the new program being offered through my leads source.
Sean
Aviva Steele & Sean Keely
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dawnmo
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#3 · Posted: 18 Oct 2007 12:08
Personally, I don't think that was an 'official' list...I think someone just put that together to try to soften the YTB blow, but who knows.
There would be no reason for Coastal to be on it since we don't deal directly with RC. I can understand Intelitravel being on it, and maybe the companies that Coastal books through...but not Coastal itself.
I know Joystar was on that list and I would like to know 'officially' whether or not they were affected. There is controversy surrounding Joystar...as to whether they are MLM or not. They do have a training program where experienced agents earn part of the commission of the new agents, but I am not sure I would call that 'MLM'. Joystar is not looked upon favorably by the traditional travel agents, for whatever reasons.
It will be interesting to see what the ramifications will be. It could all be very minor and blow over, or we could see other companies following RC's lead to sever ties with the MLM travel companies.
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hsimpsonjr
Joined: 16 Dec 2006
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#4 · Posted: 18 Oct 2007 12:12
Hi Sean,
The list that was posted on WAHM had inteletravel and Coastal on it. I don't know why Joystar was on it because they don't give you a card. You have to sell several thousands of dollars of travel before they will let you apply for a card so I wouldn't consider them a card mill. They are actually working against cardmills. I would imagine RCI will regret this because YTB and others were producing MILLIONS of dollars in revenue for them.
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asskusabouttrav
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#5 · Posted: 18 Oct 2007 12:18
It seems that there are more than one of these press releases floating around. I am unsure why Coastal would appear on any list.
I only saw YTB and Joystar. Maybe we should all exchange press releases or postings we have seen and see what we come up with.
Sean
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hsimpsonjr
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#6 · Posted: 18 Oct 2007 12:21
This is what was posted on the WAHM board in their YTB area:
Here is a list of who got "The Letter" from one of the Ring Leaders of ARTA.
* AMERICAN TRAVEL BUREAU
* CASH CARD WORLDWIDE aka K & E TRAVEL
* CERTRAV.NET
* CERTIFIED TRAVEL SERVICES
* COASTAL VACATION CLUB
* GLOBAL TRAVEL INTERNATIONAL
* GT TRENDS formerly PRT TRAVEL
* HOLIDAY PLANNERS aka INFINITE FRONTIERS and formerly AMERICAN VOYAGER, not to be confused with Holiday Planners, Branson, Missouri
* INTELETRAVEL
* JOYSTAR now called TRAVELSTAR and formerly ADVANCED REFRIGERATION
* PROTRAVEL NETWORK, not to be confused with ProTravel International
* TRAVELOGIA already cooked
* TRAVELWIZE aka CYBERWIZE
* WORLD VENTURES TRAVEL
* YTB INTERNATIONAL aka YOUR TRAVEL BIZ, YTBCARS, YTB TRAVEL NETWORK and REZconnecTECHNOLOGIES
Our friends with other companies who are being told "We are fine" are sadly mistaken.
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dawnmo
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#7 · Posted: 18 Oct 2007 12:33
For those of you who like to read the debates on message boards...there is plenty to enjoy here:
http://tinyurl.com/36j32g
Happy reading!
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asskusabouttrav
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#8 · Posted: 18 Oct 2007 12:45
This is one of the two announcements that I read.
I certainly hope its alright for me to put this here. If not Vishal I apologize but it is pertinant to our discussion.
Sean
Top Stories & Trends
Royal Caribbean Drops Joystar in "Card Mill" Purge
Published on: October 17, 2007
Royal Caribbean Cruises Ltd.'s move last week to drop travel agencies that it considers to be "card mills" has apparently hit a large host agency that claims it does not engage in "card mill" practices. Bill Alverson, chairman and CEO of Joystar and parent company Travelstar, said his agency last week was informed by Royal Caribbean that it had been terminated. In a meeting yesterday with Royal Caribbean, Alverson said, Joystar was unable to convince the cruise line's executives to change their decision. He said his agency was given until Nov. 9, when the termination goes into effect.
"There's no way in the world we could be considered a card mill," Alverson said. "We believe it is a misunderstanding. We would never ever recruit someone who is trying to save on their on travel." He said Joystar asked Royal Caribbean for evidence of specific practices that it needed to change, but the cruise line's executives would not provide any information. Joystar is a member of OSSN, a premium member of ASTA, and a member of Vacation.com.
Alverson said Joystar currently has roughly 1,300 outside travel agents selling roughly $100 million in cruises, including, he said, about $10 million this year in Royal Caribbean sailings alone. "There may be no other course of action for us than to call the attorneys and battle it out that way," he said. "I don't believe they understand our agents' resolve and how they take this personally."
A Royal Caribbean spokesman, responding to an email request, said the company would not release a list of the agencies that had been terminated. But YTB International last week said that Royal Caribbean had terminated its relationship with the company. Several sources said agencies possibly being targeted by the cruise line include Fresno, Calif.-based Pro Travel Network and Orlando-based Global Travel International, among others. Emailed questions to those companies had not been responded to at press time.
Sean
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jnapier
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#9 · Posted: 18 Oct 2007 12:52 · Edited by: jnapier
Personally, I see it as a dumb marketing move on the part of Royal Caribbean. These fam trips are about the best reason to sign up with what some would call a Card Mill....and there are some out there.
When do book travel or we go on a Royal Caribbean trip, it fills empty rooms and it also allows for some great marketing. I personally went on a Fam trip in September on Carnival and when I checked out, I'd spent $1500....so, who's losing on this??
I don't know why there has been a list of companies published and why Coastal is on the list at all...I don't konw. But I do know that what I've seen was for YTB, but listed other companies.
Jay NaPier
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asskusabouttrav
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#10 · Posted: 18 Oct 2007 13:12
I would have to agree with Jay
No matter what company we are talking about, the card mills or otherwise. These groups of independants are providing a service to Cruise lines and resorts by filling those empty rooms.
Again, I am transferring to a group that offers true credentials and education. But who knows what will happen in future. Will cruise lines like RCCL change the criteria again later on down the road.
At any rate I truly believe that education is the key.
I am looking at going with Hemisphere for my credentials.
Any thoughts on this group, please post them here. I am researching it thoroughly but still have questions.
Sean
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jsf
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#11 · Posted: 20 Oct 2007 15:04
So, please, first of all, what is exactly the problem with Royal Caribbean?
Secondly, does anybody know how "the problem" with Royal Caribbean can affect us?
If Coastal is on the black list, it is, period.
Do we keep RCCL in the back burner meantime while the situation clarifies.
I 'd expect the BOD will let us know asap as to what to do.
Hey, I do not want to misrepresent and get in hot water by saying that RC cruises are in OUR list, follow?
Things like this have to be clarified pronto, if possible, the whys are obvious.
Much luck!
Joe.
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jnapier
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#12 · Posted: 20 Oct 2007 18:34
Hey Joe,
Since we do not work directly with RCCL, it won't effect us. Should something change...it would be announced on the weekly updates sent out by COA Network.
Jay NaPier
Platinum Director
Coastal Vacations
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coastalsusan
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#13 · Posted: 22 Oct 2007 06:02
I know the "letter" from the ring leaders lists Joystar. I think they are confusing Joystar with another travel agency. Joystar is a host travel agency that works with many different certified travel agent companies. They don't give out IATA cards. You have to earn the card by selling at least $5000.00 worth of travel within a year. They pull from various wholesale travel dealers and are very professional. I can't imagine Royal Caribbean will stop working with them because they work through many many wholesale vendors that are all professional and official.
They don't have a bad reputation with travel agencies. Many travel agencies work with them. They are a very professional travel agency. If anything the travel agencies don't like them because they offer a home based travel agent which causes additional competition. They are not an mlm. They are an official travel host agency that gives travel agents access to many wholesalers that offers deals to their clients. You cannot have all the benefits of a travel agent unless you have earned your IATA card. That means no FAM trips or discounts.
Joystar is not called Travelstar. It is still Joystar. Just want to set this straight. This is a true travel agent host and official.
Susan
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joesosa
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#14 · Posted: 25 Oct 2007 12:35
Jay,
Where/how can one see COA's weekly updates?...are these updates for COA's clients exclusively?
If so, how to get the updates ref. the RCCL's situation?
There are now over 180K Coastal directors. How are they notified or kept informd about some happening that would affect the package's legitimacy and/or significant changes in our offerins?
Joe.
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cgmom
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#15 · Posted: 25 Oct 2007 14:25
RCCL will be guests on the TraVerus travel radio show next week. I am anxious to see what, if anything is said about the whole situation.
No one can understand why Joystar was on the list!!
Did we ever find out for sure if Coastal was really on there or not and if we were, why? We don't book travel through Coastal??
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jnapier
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#16 · Posted: 25 Oct 2007 14:25
Great question Joe,
You can get the weekly updates by subscribing to the COA Network system. This is where announcements are broadcast to Coastal Members.
Jay NaPier
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ibizniz
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#17 · Posted: 28 Oct 2007 00:41
Hello
with the list you referenced Harold....this all seems really odd, especially as why anyone would add Travelogia to the list, they closed their doors back in Oct 2004.
Coastal does not book anything directly, we use licensed and bonded travel agents for our bookings, so I just do not see why coastal is on the list, unless as stated this is a decoy for the real story concerning YTB.
cheers
Maria
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scumpston
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#18 · Posted: 2 Nov 2007 07:53
I believe in the end YTB is looking at a class action lawsuit from some of its member to get their money refunded. I looked at this for long time. I am a member of YTB but I agree with RCCL. We have no education to sell travel the right way. I would bet soon the other cruise lines will follow. Travel is travel business not MLM
Sam
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hsimpsonjr
Joined: 16 Dec 2006
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#19 · Posted: 3 Nov 2007 11:18
Sam,
I am not a member of YTB or any other mlm but I have to disagree with you. Travel can work for MLM companies and it has for several years. Training is key and I agree that people should get the training they need to get the IATAN card or CLIA card but considering that you guys actually created 13 million dollars of business for them I would say you guys are obviously an asset to them and NOT a problem for anyone except the jealous travel agents who are losing their business to the travelers friends and family who are members of these mlm travel agent companies.
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jnapier
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#20 · Posted: 3 Nov 2007 12:13
Quoting: hsimpsonjr I am not a member of YTB or any other mlm but I have to disagree with you. Travel can work for MLM companies and it has for several years. Training is key and I agree that people should get the training they need to get the IATAN card or CLIA card but considering that you guys actually created 13 million dollars of business for them I would say you guys are obviously an asset to them and NOT a problem for anyone except the jealous travel agents who are losing their business to the travelers friends and family who are members of these mlm travel agent companies.
Very well said Harold!!
You know, the travel industry has changed over the last few years. We now have more options that we ever did when Carnival and RCCL first began running ads on TV. There's alot of risk in taking vacations and the such.
I've booked a cruise with Inteletravel and it went very well. The person handling the transacation was very good about providing important information.
Now, on the other side of the coin I went on a cruise in September and the travel company I used for that trip was not so good. I took 21 days of vacation in September 2006 and 3 days after I left my boarding passes and information for my cruise arrived at my office. This created extra work getting onto the ship for the cruise. This easily could have been avoided had the travel company sent the boarding passes earlier.
Jay NaPier
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