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Message |
ModernRock
Member
Joined: 18 Aug 2008
Posts: 2
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# Posted: 5 Sep 2008 13:49
Why are you paying $480 up front and a $100 a month to stay active or get your full returns. There are websites that pay you cash back without having to pay any fees (Live Search Cash Back, UPromise, Fat Wallet, etc.). MOST people will lose money and if you don't mind signing up friends, that will possibly lose money, then your beyond reproach. If you do appreciate your friends then you would refer them to free sites that offer much better rebates. You're not making much cash back on your purchases through STE. You make your money RECRUITING other marks!!!!!!!! Wake Up, this is about RECRUITING!!!!!!!!!
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bgct1
Member
Joined: 7 Sep 2008
Posts: 1
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# Posted: 7 Sep 2008 17:13
I have received my first check, a day earlier than promised, and so have others I know that have signed up.
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Youssef
Member
Joined: 9 Sep 2008
Posts: 1
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# Posted: 9 Sep 2008 22:41
There is 300 million in the USA, and so fare there is about 30000 people that joined shop to earn. So no fear about this model, and add to that you are shopping in top shopping website that are interested in increasing the internet sales. That's the bottom line, internet sales are in the rise and more and more people are using online for their shopping.
This thing work, the person who referred me just made $1,5oo in 10 days... everybody can have a share of this rising business..why not you too. Jump on it
GO GO don't waste your time
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BillChechel
Member
Joined: 8 Jan 2008
Posts: 158
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# Posted: 10 Sep 2008 16:59
I have read this entire thread and am overwhelmed by the current or past members that are angry or dissappointed by the outcome of their STE businesses.
I was approached the other day with STE and am really not interested in the program as I already promote and am successful with another business.
But my business associate(the one who introduced me to STE) is very excited thus far. The commission plan is confusing and I do not like the $100 forced purchases as that was never mentioned to me.
Also, are these major companies listed on the site acutally affiliated with STE? Just the fact that Walmart.com was on the list gave me a false sense of legitamacy. Maybe someone can enlighten me on this a little.
I really am weary of this company because of the lack of a contact number on the website. And lets face it, they have not been around long enough to rely on their staying power. I had a feeling most of the money was coming from new signups and that lends itself to a pyramid which is bound to collapse.
But I am open minded enough to have read all the posts and would really like to hear of someone who actually received the money owed to them.
__________________
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Dpark
Member
Joined: 26 Aug 2008
Posts: 5
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# Posted: 10 Sep 2008 19:04 · Edited by: Dpark
I understand how some people may have misconceptions of STE being a pyramid and all the income is based on new recruits but that is not so.
The core business is all about the shopping. Every day i get points from my down line because people are shopping and the cash back they are recieving are being translated into points. Even if i dont do any more recruiting with the 30 or so people in my business i expect to score once every couple of months just from the shopping that everyone else is doing as well. AS long as i qualify by referring my two people and spending my 100 bucks on green products each month which in turn also translate into points etc. But if you dont want to spend the hundred dollars you just forfiet any commisions and or points that you had for that month.
No one says you HAVE to spend the 100 dollars you only spend it if you want to colllect on this months points or have them roll over to the following month so you can score.
Initally you do have to recruit or "refer" in order to get started but all anyone NEEDs do is to do is refer two people minimunm to qualify as a broker and three to qualify as a Business builder.
But i was blessed in the fact that 6 of my friends/family members saw STE for what it was, an opportunity to get cash back on the purchases we all make online everyday as well as the opporunity to make money from referring our other friends that shop online and giving them an opportunity to make money as well.
Of course the more people in your downline the more points that will be generated from people purchasing from their websites and hence more points that come up every month.
I understand that this business isnt for everyone and i understand that things arent being handeled in an effective manner (in regards to contact number and refunds) but It is a startup company and a lot of it is growing pains. If your interested in joining up i say go into it knowing that STE is growing and evolving every day, new vendors are added to both the shop to earth and shop to earn side those of you that have the vision to get in now while STE is still fairly new have a very good chance of making a lot of money.
I have been an ste member since July 13th 2008 and I have seen the core business working (points coming up from shopping) and yes i have seen the money as was promised (I double checked my routing numbers) on the 20th a full day before they said it will be disbursed. and i believe!
Yes there are free sites that have affilate programs that get you cash back but how do you earn real income from using them. At best your saving a little here and a little there. With STE the cash back you recieve from shopping is being converted into points and well the points do add up. And when people say that you need to spend 9k at a 5% return just to make your 448 back, i can honestly say to that person please explain to my wife, that after 9k it's ok to stop shopping because we made our money back. The next year i only need to spend 1500 to make back the 68 dollar renewal fee, So after the first year the savings is dramatically increased.
Hmm sounds familiar didnt BJ's and SAMs club start this way as well with their referral programs? STE is a bit pricier to get involved initially but the renewal costs are lower and i have access to over 500 major retailers on the internet.
As a family we spend more than 9k during the course of the year easy and i know that there are a lot of other people out there in the same situation of being consumers as well.
But what if, instead of going to the stores i can get my family to shop on my ste website and get cash back and points = cash
to me that is value and you know what? I'm IN 100% let me shave my head put on the ceremonial robes because if you believe in STE then you must be a cult member or an idiot or even a scammer
But the way i see it every 21st of the month i look at my checking account and I have to smirk and wish all of the non believers out there the best of luck in whatever your endeavors are because all that is left to be said is CHA-CHING!
__________________
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BillChechel
Member
Joined: 8 Jan 2008
Posts: 158
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# Posted: 10 Sep 2008 20:01
Dpark,
Thank you for putting everything into perspective. I like the way you explained the business with no hype and just plain facts.
There will always be naysayers out there that do not like the MLM/Network Marketing business model and thats fine. But its nice to see a straighfoward approach to teaching others about your opportunity.
Do you advertise and promote this business online? I see an affiliate link in your sig file. The person who introduced me to STE stated that most do not advertise online. I cannot see this as true. The whole premise of this business is to capture a piece of the evergrowing internet market. So to take on a more traditional MLM approach seems outdated and shortsighted.
__________________
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Robinator
Member
Joined: 12 Sep 2008
Posts: 11
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# Posted: 12 Sep 2008 17:32
So how many people did you have to recruit to make $8000.00? I completely understand the pay plan and for you to make 8k in 18 days, you would have needed to recruit MASSIVE amounts of people!
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Robinator
Member
Joined: 12 Sep 2008
Posts: 11
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# Posted: 12 Sep 2008 17:48
I was on one of the webinars for STE last night and I must say that this business model appears to be VERY, VERY difficult to make money. I want to make some key points about STE that stood out to me.
1. STE is not consumer friendly AT ALL. What I mean by that is, as a customer, I would never want to shop there. Why do you ask?? If you look at the top shopping sites on the web, most of them offer consumer reviews, which is something I always use "they do not offer this", they don't have comparative shopping, meaning when you for example go to Amazon and you type in the name of the product your looking to buy, multiple choices of where you can buy it from will come up with the prices listed so you can find the product for the lowest price. They do not have a product search bar, only a store search. So if you were looking for a Garmin Nuvi GPS system for example you would have to click on electronics, all their electronics stores would pop up, you would then have to click on each store to see if they carry the product and compare the prices on your own??? Who would want to waste all that time??? So it appears to me, in my opinion, that these sites are geared for the people in STE to buy from because they have an incentive, but someone not in the program "maybe a friend you want to shop from you" would not want to shop at the site because it is not user friendly.
2. If you look at how the pay structure works, the bulk of the money comes from recruiting, not from distribution of products. If you look at the % of points you acquire from shopping from them, it would take a very, very long time to get a check. But when you recruit someone in you get 200 points, hmmmm very little points for shopping and much higher points for recruiting. I too am in the network marketing industry and have become very successful in this field, but the bulk of my money comes from the movement of product, not from recruiting.
When I broke down what it would take to make a substantial on-going residual income based on the purchasing of product only not the recruiting income, I was surprised at how much spending from the group/down line it would take to make even a little bit of money. As with most new companies STE is most likely going through a learning curve and who knows, maybe they will improve on what they are doing, but for me its not the right business model. it is definitely more about recruiting than shopping, no question!
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Robinator
Member
Joined: 12 Sep 2008
Posts: 11
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# Posted: 13 Sep 2008 12:10
Read this:
CASE HISTORY NEW (BURN LOUNGE) TO OLDER CASES
The U.S. FTC has been moving steadily toward measuring the amount of Sales to Distributors compared to the dollar amount generated by sales to end consumers (Customers that do not belong to the pay plan). If there aren't enough Customers, the MLM Company is considered a Pyramid Scheme. Regulators have found that pure pyramid schemes don't have any end consumer customers. The definition of a Customer is a person that only buys product or services and doesn't belong to the compensation plan and has no expectation of making money. The FTC Consumer Affairs people said in public speeches (not written rules) that MLM � Network Marketing Companies need to have a minimum of 50% Customers (that do not belong to the pay plan) to prove they are not a pyramid scheme. They have also said (not in writing) that 3 years would be a fair time for a new company.
I can DEFINITELY see this being a problem for STE, why you ask? There is no incentive for people to shop at the sight unless they distributors of STE. Please read my blog above explaining why.
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Robinator
Member
Joined: 12 Sep 2008
Posts: 11
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# Posted: 13 Sep 2008 12:24
More info, I'm telling ya, be careful!
the Latest 9 June 2007. The FTC filed a TRO (Temporary Restraining Order)! The FTC said that Burn Lounge paid $50 for recruiting two new MLM Distributors, while paying only 50 cents per 2 albums sold, per the FTC complaint. Ouch! Can you spell Pyramid by FTC standards? The money in Burn Lounge was coming from recruiting.... Not the 50% of income from Customers/Product Sales the FTC wants. I bet Burn Lounge execs and the Investors that committed $40 million had studied the history of the FTC and Customer Requirements that you are reading now! By the way, Burn Lounge killed it's MLM Program by converting to a one level affiliate program quickly and the FTC settled the case. Their stock is dead and the $40 million of investment money is down the drain. As an honest hard working top Compensation Plan Consultant I could have fixed this for a few thousand dollars! Sad to waste $40 million! Read On Below!
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OK2
Member
Joined: 14 Sep 2008
Posts: 1
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# Posted: 14 Sep 2008 08:21
The great thing about this concept is that I made my money back in just one month. The greatest part of the deal is that I save rediculous amounts of gas money every month. The amount of time to me is comparable because I am online searching numerous companies to find the best deal. It's like a game! And I save.
As far as the $100 spent per month. You get money back so you are only spending $80. I spend that anyway in Target, Wal-Mart, grocery stores etc... If you take the time to browse through the Shop to Earth side, you will find more than you need. I am holding off from spending over $200 on the "green" side so I have some of it for next month. Nutrition bars, cleaning supplies, etc...
The business model is a no-brainer. You need to realize that it's not a race. It may take you 6 months to see results. If you say or tell someone one thing everyday about Shop To Earn, you will do well with it!
Have an open mind. It works 
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birdie
Member
Joined: 16 Sep 2008
Posts: 1
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# Posted: 16 Sep 2008 10:49
Where you a broker asking for a full refund within the 14 days you joined? Did you get the full $448 back?
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Ramo
Member
Joined: 19 Sep 2008
Posts: 1
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# Posted: 19 Sep 2008 19:13
Many MLM have a big flaw is that the product they have has limited audience ei how many soaps can you buy. So you end up all this stuff in your garage from a brand nobody knows
This what I find Great about shop to earn you and the people invloved buy only what you need from the store they know. It is not for everyone and everyone should not join specailly if you are afraid to talk to people. I personally have made my money back without shopping , by havings 4 people join.
MLM have had a bad name and for a good reason. Shoptoearn is not perfect but it close to resolving many of the flaws of past MLM.
__________________
ramo1963
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Robinator
Member
Joined: 12 Sep 2008
Posts: 11
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# Posted: 20 Sep 2008 13:29
Ramo, I hear what your saying about the product part of MLM, BUT and thats a big BUT, the FTC considers any direct sales company that makes more off of recruiting than product sales and illegal pyramid scheme.
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PAMom
Member
Joined: 22 Sep 2008
Posts: 11
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# Posted: 22 Sep 2008 15:48
Shop To Earn � Is It an Illegal Pyramid?
Opinion from an Insider and FTC Rulings
Mia culpa for joining ShopTo Earn/ShopToEarth (STE) prior to doing my homework. It is so easy to get swept up in the fever of earning quick money during a home presentation where an early investor shows his paycheck. Sounds like inducement which has been deemed illegal by the FTC. However, now that I joined as a broker for $448, I would like to share some details of my direct experience which in my opinion classifies STE as a pyramid. In addition, I have included some rulings by the FTC on similar "mall" shopping companies which were forced to shut down and two FTC articles on warning signs of an illegal pyramid scheme.
First of all here is some background on the STE's design and structure. You may join STE as a Business Builder ($99) and you are only paid for recruiting others. However, to receive your commission, you or your friends "must generate at least $100 in monthly business volume through his/her website's link to ShopToEarth to become qualified to SCORE!" (taken directly from the company's commission rules; link to this document is shown below under Related Documents). The commission rules also state that a Business Builder must refer (recruit) three new Website Owners or Brokers within the first 30 days. These recruits must pay their renewal fees at the end of one year or the Business Builder must refer (recruit) another Website Owner/Broker to continue to be eligible for commission.
Or, you may join as a Web site Owner ($349) which allows you to shop with 500 retailers and earn cash back with a $69 annual renewal fee. You also earn points for anyone who shops at your Web site. However, to receive your commission through STE you or your friends "must generate at least $100 in monthly business volume through his/her website's link to ShopToEarth to become qualified to SCORE!"
Doesn't it sound great to earn cash back for shopping online? Slow down. Did you know that you can do the very same thing through many sites on the internet, earn cash back at MORE retailers and get paid to refer friends all for FREE? Some of these sites are cashbaq.com, ebates.com, mrrebates.com. For example, cashbaq.com has over 1700 retailers available and they show available online coupons per store which may be used for additional discounts. This is known as affiliate marketing where retailers pay for affiliates to promote their goods to a consumer with a direct link to the retailer's online site. The affiliate receives a rebate from the retailer and is sharing a portion of the rebate with the consumer. So, why would you, your loved ones or friends spend the $349 when you can do the same thing for free? In addition to collecting your $349, STE is receiving the rebate from the retailer as an affiliate and only sharing a portion with the member.
Then there is the Business Builder and Website Owner rolled into one position known as a Broker. The cost to become a Broker is $448 with an annual renewal fee of $119. From STE Commission Rules - "A Broker functions under the same Commission Rules as a Website Owner and a Business Builder; however, a Broker (Website Owner + Business Builder) only has to refer 2 Website Owners and place at least one on the Left Side and at least one on the Right Side to become qualified to SCORE! A Broker has an annual renewal fee of $119 and 50 points are paid to that Broker (Website Owner + Business Builder) and up-line to all Business Builders." Again, to receive your commission through STE, you or your friends "must generate at least $100 in monthly business volume through his/her website's link to ShopToEarth to become qualified to SCORE!"
As for the requirement to purchase $100 in ShopToEarth products monthly, I have looked through the green products available and I cannot come up with $100 that I need every month. I also feel that most of the prices on these green products are inflated and this requirement only serves to put more "green" into the pockets of the top levels. Yes, STE is truly a "green" company.
So if you found $100 from the ShopToEarth site to purchase and now you are ready to receive your commission. But wait, there's more. Your are not eligible to receive your commission unless your right and left side are balance. Now the complexity comes into the genealogy of the tree you are creating on your right and left side. Remember, as a Broker, you must recruit one person on your right and one on your left which begins your tree. To earn your commission, at least 1/3 of your total points must come from one side. Why is this put into place? It forces you to continually recruit new members on your weaker side. New recruits mean more money. Think about it though. Everyone is trying to balance their sides. So if I have a strong right side but someone below me on that side is weak, they will continually try to recruit more on my strong side. I don't want this. It will make my strong side even stronger! Yikes. Why was this put in place? The company ensures solvency through your continual balancing act of recruiting new members and not paying commission to existing members who are out of balance.
Here are some other issues that I have with STE:
1.STE readily promotes checks on the STE Tour call, at home presentations, seminars and on individual Web sites. You can go to any member's Web site, click on their picture in the lower left corner and then click on $ My Check to see the member's check. In my opinion, this is inducement and is illegal according to the FTC.
2.In order to not classify as a pyramid, FTC states that 50% of the business must come from customers not being paid commissions. STE owns the ShopToEarth products so this means that 50% of the business in ShopTo Earth must come from those purchasing products yet not receiving any commissions. Good luck with that one STE especially since as of September 2008 you now require all members to purchase $100 in products from ShopToEarth to receive commission.
3.STE is promoting business as if they have teamed up with Home Depot, Target, Staples, etc... This is misleading. STE is merely an affiliate and they offer a link to major retailers. In my opinion, this is deceptive and an attempt to legitimize the company.
4.To be a legitimate company, refunds must be made to consumers. STE promises to refund your money if you put in a ticket within the first 14 days. There are several blogs about people not being able to get their refund as promised, which leads to the next issue.
5.No STE telephone number available anywhere on the Web site.
6.Bullying tactics of STE attorney (Nehra) with cease and desist communication to bloggers on the internet who are questioning the legality of STE. Why this tactic? Does STE have something to hide and what about our right to freedom of speech?
What does the company say about itself? Under About Us on the STE Web site, Patrick Welsh, founder, the verbiage reads -"Pat has spent the last 10 years creating and developing this ShopToEarn platform that couples networking and e-commerce. By forming partnerships with the biggest names in retail while seeking out positive partnerships with the finest green companies, our mission of helping people become healthier and wealthier is being realized by many.
Our ability to interface and partner with companies that produce products that are good for us and good for the planet will define our uniqueness as our mission of creating a wave of health and wealth and making a difference is ultimately our contribution that future generations will be proud of."
In my opinion, STE is merely a recruiting scheme hiding under the guise of teaming up with the larger retailers (aka affiliate marketing) and promoting a "Green" company which is good for the planet. Pat's message fails to tell you that the monthly $100 purchase of the overly inflated (opinion-but see my next post on actual research which confirm my opinion) green products are mandatory to receive your commission or your points are wiped out. However, even though your points are wiped out, these points are still generated up-line. Who benefits the most? STE since they own the ShopToEarth products and of course, those at the top of the pyramid. The $100 monthly requirement is passed off as being in line with the company's philosophy when in actuality it is keeping the company solvent at the expense of the members.
With all of this information and knowledge of the FTC rulings on similar companies, I cannot in good conscious recruit members (even strangers) to sign up when they can shop online for free and get cash back and money for referring friends who also don't have to fork over $448 plus $100 per month in products. And I failed to mention that you may not get the best price for your purchase as well as previously mentioned by another post. The STE site does not have a search engine for the product offered at the lowest price like Amazon.com or NexTag.com. You could use these sites to first see which retailer is offering the lowest price then come to STE and see if the retailer is on the list. If it's not on the list, you could purchase it from a retailer on STE and your cash back may equal the cost offered by the lowest retailer. So, have you saved anything by spending $448 to join STE? No. You make money by recruiting and the FTC has ruled this as illegal.
FTC Rulings on Similar Online Mall Companies and FTC Related Articles on Pyramids
How does the FTC weigh in on this type of business? Below are some recent FTC rulings on online malls and an FTC related consumer article on how to spot a pyramid.
1. FTC shut down two previous shopping internet malls with links to retailers. Key passages from the article are detailed below along with the link to the to the entire FTC article:
For Release: May 12, 2005
FTC Cracks down on Internet Mall Pyramid Promoters
Operators of online malls that disguised themselves as legitimate business opportunities have settled Federal Trade Commission charges that they were
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PAMom
Member
Joined: 22 Sep 2008
Posts: 11
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# Posted: 22 Sep 2008 15:53
As most of you know, ShopToEarn/Earth requires that you spend $100 per month from their "green" retailers in order to receive your commission. In addition to forcing you to buy these products, you are spending far more than if you purchased these same products from other online retailers. For some of the vitamins I researched, you are spending almost double the cost AFTER YOUR CASH BACK. Below is a brief comparison of the prices I found on a quick search. To ensure proof of my claims that I am comparing "apples to apples", I have screen shots of all products and prices.
1. Alacer Emergen C MuliVitamins Kids Strawberry 36 packets
Vitacost.com Price = $7.37
ShopToEarth Price = $17.45 - $2.62 (cash back) =14.83 ($7.46 MORE)
Way to go STE. Not only do your investors have to wait 1 month for their cash back (minus $5.00 for direct deposit fee), they are spending $7.46 MORE. Where is that extra profit going????
2. Alacer Emergen-C 1000 mg Vitamin C Tropical 36 packets
Amazon.com Price =$6.89
ShopToEarth Price = $14.95 � $2.24 (cash back) = $12.71 ($5.82 MORE)
These outrageous mark-ups are not limited to vitamins. Below are some other examples of STE's overly inflated products they are forcing on their members.
3. Chocolite Protein Bars Cookies N Cream (16 bars)
Netrition.com Price = $16.99
ShopToEarth Price = $23.49-$3.52 (cash back) = $19.97 ($2.98 MORE)
4. Ark Naturals Sea Mobility Chicken Jerky Strips 3/ 9 ounce strips
Vitacost.com Price = 3 X $7.87 each = $23.61
ShopToEarth Price = $37.47 - $5.62 (cash back) = $31.85 ($8.24 MORE)
I found these in less than 20 minutes of comparison shopping. I have a good hunch that this price inflation is rampant through the green store which makes the founders and those at the top very green. WAKE UP STE investors!!!
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dale52872
Member
Joined: 22 Sep 2008
Posts: 1
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# Posted: 22 Sep 2008 16:05
Hello David Park,
Just had to go to your STE site to see what your name is...great acct of your business so far. I joined as a Broker 7/21 - on 8/20 $345 was deposited into our checking acct and last Friday 9/19 we received our August commission of $1600+. Just as it should be, just as promised. This is a great opportunity for additional income...yes I have met the top earners that make approx $7K per day with 15,ooo people under them...I have 106 below me and have referred just 8 people myself...it is a joint effort - as the founder says the great billionaires of the world "Use Other Peoples Ideas, Other People's Money and Other Peoples' Efforts" to help them make their Money! This is so true...it is not snap your fingers and money appears, ANY business takes time, effort and work! We do have to spend the $100 from the Earth side each month...did people who invested in GOOGLE or any other company not have to put ALOT of money into their company??? We spend money on product that we choose, we do not have to purchase specific product and store it in our garages so sell to someone else...this business opportunity is not for everyone. Some people's minds are just not open to new opportunities and if they are happy with their present income, who are we to tell them otherwise...as far as all the negativity about Shop To Earn...hey look on the internet about our presidential candidates...are the STE nay sayers not voting for one of the candidates because both have GOBS of negativity attached to their names????
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PAMom
Member
Joined: 22 Sep 2008
Posts: 11
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# Posted: 23 Sep 2008 09:57
For the misguided who think they are making money by shopping hence the name, Shop To Earn, here are some more of the outrageous mark-ups in the Shop To Earth site which you are forced to spend $100 per month to receive commission. You are NOT making money on sales, you are making money by suckering others into signing up which is a classic pyramid. It is only a matter of time before the FTC catches on. Frankly I don't want my name associated with such a fraudulent business but others seem to have no scruples and have no problem taking $448 from friends, family and loved ones. I have not found one product on the Shop To Earth site which is equal to or less than the price offered by other online retailers. And, of course these other retailers are making a profit off of their products which means Shop To Earth is gauging its own members!!!!
Myvitanet.com Aloha Bay Mistletoe Bouquet Candle 21. oz $12.35
ShopToEarth Aloha bAy Mistletoe Bouquet Candle 21. oz $21.99 - $3.30 cash back = $18.69
$6.34 (MORE)
Myvitanet.com Aloha Bay Ocean Mist Candle 21. oz
$12.35
ShopToEarth Aloha Bay Ocean Mist Candle 21. oz
$21.99 - $3.30 cash back = $18.69
$6.34 (MORE)
Vitapal.com George's Aloe Vera Shampoo 8 oz.
$3.75
ShopToEarth George's Aloe Vera Shampoo 8 oz.
$5.95 - $.89 cash back = $5.06
$1.31 (MORE)
Vitapal.com George's Aloe Vera Conditioner 8 oz.
$4.49
ShopToEarth George's Aloe Vera Conditioner 8 oz.
$6.89 - $1.03 cash back = $5.86
$1.37 (MORE)
Vitaminthrift.com Genisoy Ultra-XT Soy Protein Shake Chocolate 22 oz. $12.91
ShopToEarth Genisoy Ultra-XT Soy Protein Shake Chocolate 22 oz. $20.19 - $3.03 cash back = $17.16
$4.25 (MORE)
Imedmart.com Genisoy Protein Bars Chocolate Chip 12-1.58 oz bars $12.92
ShopToEarth Genisoy Protein Bars Chocolate Chip 12-1.58 oz bars $19.99 - $3.00 cash back = $17.99
$5.07 (MORE)
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yolo
Member
Joined: 25 Sep 2008
Posts: 5
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# Posted: 25 Sep 2008 13:10
pamom you said you joined up with ste, have you cancelled your membership? did you sign anyone up?
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yolo
Member
Joined: 25 Sep 2008
Posts: 5
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# Posted: 25 Sep 2008 13:29
To Dpark How much was deposited in your account last week for your August business?
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yolo
Member
Joined: 25 Sep 2008
Posts: 5
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# Posted: 25 Sep 2008 13:37
pamom The additional markup of the items on shop to earth vs what can be found on other sites is the margin used to pay upline members. It basically makes everyone in the line a distributer/retailer and if you add up all the upline dollars paid from all the downline purchasers it will offset any lower price found elsewhere. The upline earnings for all aspects of the revenue stream from recruiting and purchasing makes the lower price moot.
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yolo
Member
Joined: 25 Sep 2008
Posts: 5
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# Posted: 25 Sep 2008 18:52
to pamom, in addition the cost of joining the brokerage side of the concept is just $99, which is below the threshold fo $200 to $500 to be classified as a business opportunity, which is set by the FTC in determining whether the company should be investigated. The cost of purchasing a website for $349 to be able to purchase through the portal and obtain cash back is not considered a part of the investment for the mlm. The attorney for ste was with Amway for years and is fully qualified in assuring the company stays with-in the rules.
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BillChechel
Member
Joined: 8 Jan 2008
Posts: 158
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# Posted: 25 Sep 2008 22:18
I have heard alot on the FTCs law on inducement.
Does anyone have any links to this exact law? I would love to see how this is worded and exactly how the FTC defines inducement.
__________________
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PAMom
Member
Joined: 22 Sep 2008
Posts: 11
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# Posted: 26 Sep 2008 10:03
Yolo,
I understand clearly why the reason for the outrageous mark-ups in the ShopToEarth products. The price gauging makes those above you rich at the expense of those lower in the pyramid (oh, I mean hieracrchy, LOL). And, as of Sept 2008, members are forced to buy these overly inflated products to support the payment upline. What a joke.
As for your laywer previously with Amway- are you saying the STE has figured out the loopholes and is now able to fly below the radar of the FTC? Makes perfect sense to ensure that the $448 is just below the threshold of investment. So the brain trust of STE went to the former Amway lawyer and said, OK, how do we create a pyramid to get rich quick and avoid the FTC watchdog? Sounds very, very shady. Also, since you know so much of the background in STE, are you part of the brain trust?
You haven't come up with a rebuttal to the FTC rule that 50 % of the sales must come from consumers NOT involved with the commission plan though. You (and your Amway lawyer) probably already know that the FTC usually allows three years for a company to prove that this is happening. Hum, I wonder if STE will take down their shingle and vanish into the night in about two years?
No, I wasn't able to request a refund because my research came after the 14 day period. I am a single mom and my own mother is on hospice care and living with me. Needless to say, my life is quite chaotic and difficult at this period in time. Otherwise I would have done my homework prior to signing up. In addition, if it wasn't for my emotional state of watching my mother die, I most likely would not have done so in the heat of the moment. That's what happens though to victims who are facing difficult times in their life when money is a crunch and you see this plan to make quick money and checks are shown up on the screen- you fall pray.
I am only hoping to prevent others from falling pray. If I can save at least one other person, then it is worth it. Sure, I could make money by recruiting others but I have a moral fiber which is too strong. At the end of the day, I have to look myself in the mirror and feel good about the person in the reflection.
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PAMom
Member
Joined: 22 Sep 2008
Posts: 11
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# Posted: 26 Sep 2008 10:05
Yolo,
I understand clearly why the reason for the outrageous mark-ups in the ShopToEarth products. The price gauging makes those above you rich at the expense of those lower in the pyramid (oh, I mean hierarchy, LOL). And, as of Sept 2008, members are forced to buy these overly inflated products to support the payment upline. What a joke.
As for your lawyer previously with Amway- are you saying the STE has figured out the loopholes and is now able to fly below the radar of the FTC? Makes perfect sense to ensure that the $448 is just below the threshold of investment. So the brain trust of STE went to the former Amway lawyer and said, OK, how do we create a pyramid to get rich quick and avoid the FTC watchdog? Sounds very, very shady. Also, since you know so much of the background in STE, are you part of the brain trust?
You haven't come up with a rebuttal to the FTC rule that 50 % of the sales must come from consumers NOT involved with the commission plan though. You (and your Amway lawyer) probably already know that the FTC usually allows three years for a company to prove that this is happening. Hum, I wonder if STE will take down their shingle and vanish into the night in about two years?
No, I wasn't able to request a refund because my research came after the 14 day period. I am a single mom and my own mother is on hospice care and living with me. Needless to say, my life is quite chaotic and difficult at this period in time. Otherwise I would have done my homework prior to signing up. In addition, if it wasn't for my emotional state of watching my mother die, I most likely would not have done so in the heat of the moment. That's what happens though to victims who are facing difficult times in their life when money is a crunch and you see this plan to make quick money and checks are shown up on the screen- you fall pray.
I am only hoping to prevent others from falling pray. If I can save at least one other person, then it is worth it. Sure, I could make money by recruiting others but I have a moral fiber which is too strong. At the end of the day, I have to look myself in the mirror and feel good about the person in the reflection.
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yolo
Member
Joined: 25 Sep 2008
Posts: 5
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# Posted: 26 Sep 2008 10:44
pamom Sorry to hear about your mother's condition. It is rough to see a parent fade, as I did last year with my dad. God be with you.
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PAMom
Member
Joined: 22 Sep 2008
Posts: 11
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# Posted: 26 Sep 2008 11:02
Thanks Yolo, sorry to hear about your dad. Also, here's an update from the FTC. They proposed a bill in 2006 to remove the $500 threshold. It often takes up to three years for a bill to pass so it may just be around the corner. An exerct--
FTC'S PROPOSED BUSINESS OPPORTUNITY RULE:
Why is the FTC Proposed Business Rule of such concern to the industry?
DETAILED ANALYSIS of Problematic Provisions
On April 12, 2006, the Federal Trade Commission published its Notice of Proposed Rulemaking, and its proposed Business Opportunity Rule. 71 Fed. Reg. 19,053, (April 12, 2006), (to be codified at 16 C.F.R. � 437).
This rule will markedly expand the FTC's regulation of sellers of business opportunities, and as currently written, it will mean that all network marketing/MLM companies are subject to its provisions. The original FTC Business Opportunity Rule is narrowly drawn, and excluded many ventures that should have been considered business opportunities from its scope. With the proposed rule, in its current form, the FTC has gone in the other direction, expanding its net of regulation to basically all persons who solicit another to enter into a new business. There will be no more $500 minimum payment requirements to trigger application of the rule.
For the complete article click or copy and paste:
http://www.mlmlegal.com/FTC%20Business%20Opportunity%20Rule/FTCProposed.html
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sashawk
Member
Joined: 26 Sep 2008
Posts: 61
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# Posted: 26 Sep 2008 12:45
I agree that the company's front men are too far in backdrop for me to have any confidence in the longevity of this. It's definitely a viable model though.
Sasha
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Robinator
Member
Joined: 12 Sep 2008
Posts: 11
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# Posted: 26 Sep 2008 19:49
Update:
My friend Derek has been in STE for 7 weeks and has made over $4000.00, yes I verified and he really make 4k. As all of you know, I have been saying that the FTC is definitely going to be looking into STE and after speaking with Derek today I am even more convinced. He is a newbie to this industry and when I explained to him about the FTC regulations on what is considered an illegal pyramid scheme and what is not, he turned white! I'm not kidding; he told me that he did not make any money at all from selling product, because he sold NOTHING!!!!! So that income was solely made from recruiting!!!! Now he is nervous because he has friends and family that joined up based on his recommendation because they trust him!!!
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sashawk
Member
Joined: 26 Sep 2008
Posts: 61
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# Posted: 27 Sep 2008 08:02
Yeah, I like the "no friends, no family" rule when it comes to MLM, for both the growth of the company and the reason you described Robinator.
But this guy must have a pretty huge extended family to have hit $4000 that way.
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